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[vamp]

Should I take that as a jab at myself? or just a jab at my sarcasm?

[katiesuarez]

Okay, I must have missed something. The whole bi-sexual thing has gone completely over my head.

Seriously though, I have another question. How many exercises per muscle group should you include in each workout? I thought I read sometime back that Waterbury recommended two. The problem is I want to see more results. How many exercises per muscle group could you safely do before it becomes overkill?

[swanso5]

something was lost in translation with the bi sexual thing...

anyway back to what we're here for...

as i've posted 1 million times, you should really train movements not muscles of which are there are 6 main one's
1 - shoulder press variations
2 - pull/chin up variations
3 - bench press/push up variations
4 - row variations
5 - glute/ham variations
6 - quad variations (last 2 can overlap a little)

now wherther you do full body workouts or lower/upper splits (the only splits you should be doing), these movements are the one's to train...this ensures that you are using compound exercises and not wasting time trying to "blast your delts with 5pd lateral raises" to build shoulder width

for full body workouts you simply choose 1 exercise from each movement, make up 3 different sessioins and off you go...for sets and reps you can have specific strength quality days (strength, endurance etc) or you can mix and match within workouts to spread the work evenly over the week

for lower/upper splits you can insert more exercises as you have more time to play with but this doesn't mean inserting those lateral raises...i would set up like this:

lower day

heavy hip or quad dominant (dead/squat..if dead on 1st lower day then squat the 2nd)
single leg exercise variation
glute/ham variation
core x 1 - 2 exercises

upper

row/bench or push up
chin or pull up/shoulder press
secondary back variation (simply as it's generally neglected)/core variation

again you'd have 2 different workouts for lower and upper body

now for the matter of "i wanna do more to see better resuklts" this isn;t always the best way to go as you can use a better set/rep scheme, placement in the session and better exercise selection to mention a few

so to answer your quaestion...1 exercise per movement per session whichever way you go is enough if you do it properly...alwyn cosgrove wrote about a study (i've tried to find it but i can't) which found that bicep size was not found to be greater in the group that did chins and curls compared to chins by themselves leading me to think that just because you do more work for a muscle, it doesn't guarantee improvements ecspecially like this example as if ou can do chins with 20 extra pds than your bodyweight, the wt you could curl woudn't even be 50% of that so overall the wt is too light to really give you any benefit at all

what did you want to improve?

[katiesuarez]

Well, I know you are going to be frustrated when I say this, but it’s my back I want to improve. I guess I am starting to lose patience since (according to my journal) I have been doing rows since February 2nd and pull-ups since April 27th. I really hate my skinny back and that seems to be the only area where I cannot build any muscle, and I don’t know if it’s because of my anorexia or my injury. I just want to get to where my ribs and spine do not show anymore and my orthopedist said the only way to do that is to work my back.

I am currently doing three full body workouts per week. Here is my current routine:

1. 5 min warm-up, which is walking on a treadmill with an incline or jumping rope.
2. Single leg bridges
3. Single leg squats
4. Single leg-pulls
5. Pull-ups
6. Deadlifts (I just started these on June 8th)
7. Rows (Switched from rowing machine to dumbbell rows)
8. Dips
9. Single arm triceps extensions

I do lunges in place of leg-pulls every other month. I cannot do them every month since I have knee problems. I have gradually made the switch from machines to free weights. So, what do you think?

[DianaB]

Katie, you may just have to have some patience with this one. And I'd look at switching it up to the split that was suggested, and add in squats. They work wonders for the entire body.

Our bodies do not progress in a linear fashion. You may find that after 4 months of hard work, you see some changes, but not enough to satisfy your expectations. Then during the next month, it seems that suddenly you're hitting PRs weekly and just flying along. That's because during all your hard work in the previous months, the "improvements" were taking place internally, at a cellular level. If you damaged your body with anorexia in the past, it will take time to repair that damage.

I worked for months at building muscle and getting very little positive feedback from my body, so I understand your frustration, it's human. What turned it around for me was dedicating myself to a serious and difficult olympic program. Get into a good gym, find a good coach and lift heavy. You won't be disappointed.

And for those of you who think that this kind of lifting creates monster women, OL and PL lifting has taken me from 22% bf to 18%bf in just over 7 months, while maintaining the exact same weight of 132lbs. Not even close to a she-hulk!

[vamp]

Katiesuarez,

I understand the frustrations, for me its core, I just hate doing core work.

For back I have always found the following excercises have worked for myself.....

bent-over barbell row wide grip (compund excercise compared to dumbbell row unless doing dual dumbell row)
lat front pull downs, wide grip, 45 degrees at hip
sitting rows, no support (keep posture / straight back)
military press (free weight)

And believe it or not....
Swimming laps with breast stroke (great for full body, low impact, you can do as sprints or laps and you will love the stretch and contractions through your movements.)


Give these a try, you may like them.

[vamp]

So DianaB,

You've gone from 22% to 18% BF, that means you've gone from sexy, to even sexier, right? Curves to cuts?

wink, just teasing, I think thats great work, good for you and keep at it!

[swanso5]

- actually very happy with a back focus, very happy indeed...not many chicks ask for that
- you're starting point is way further back than anyone else because of your anorexia so it will take more time and when you have a look at it, you have over 25% of your body area to build up (back) so it's not a quick thing to fix
- your spine might always show if it's "pointy" but we can hide the ribs easily
- leg pulls??? leg curls are they??
- for muscle gain you need bigger exercises...unilateral work is good for assistance work but not the best for overall strength and mass
- the plan above is the probably the best way to go for you with a few modifications if needed
- for back we simply need to deadlift and chin up / pull up numbers up and you'ls progress
- 3 diffferent programs performed once a week is better too...the body adapts in 6 workouts so you only get 2 weeks out of one porogram
- o lifts are great

[Christopheel]

Your diet is solid,
you are lifting heavy and smartly,
Heavy exercises,
Consistent,
Increasing volume/weight every workout by a little,

Then you are on your way to have a sexy and strong back.

Give you some times,

and it will come very VERY fast. I've never trained for a long time or trained with womens so I can't compared or give you example this is why I say :

Good post Diana

[Boss Man]

Katie, look up something called Joint Formula by CNP. If you have slight back issues, it might be a way to help, along with the training.

I think they still do it.

[katiesuarez]

Yes, I did quite a bit of damage to myself internally. My weight dropped below 120lb, which is not a good look since I am 5’10’. It lowered my ability to absorb nutrients and it affected my bone density, which is why I ended up with a stress fracture in my sacrum last year. I have put on roughly 25lb in the past year and I definitely feel stronger and healthier than I did in 2006. I guess I am getting frustrated because I noticed significant gains in my first year of recovery and now, everything has come to a halt.

I found this site about Olympic Weightlifting:

http://tomgorman.moonfruit.com/#

I think that is something I need to work towards by lifting heavier. I would eventually like to try that, but not until I get my numbers up a bit.

Vamp, believe it or not, I like doing core work. I used to be one of those cardio bunnies, spending an hour at a time running followed by lots of crunches. Now, I have cut way back on the cardio and I never work my abs (I could not do crunches even if I wanted to because of my fracture). I have found that everything else I do has made them stronger and more defined. I have always had a flat stomach, but now I actually have a slight two pack and a line down the middle and that did not happen until after I stopped all the excessive cardio and crunches.

I do love swimming. I used to swim a lot all the way through high school. Now, I just don’t have the time to go to a pool. Plus, I try not to get too much sun at my old age (I’m going to be 32 this Saturday!).

Swanso, I was doing unilateral work for some things so that I would not favor one side over the other. As a result of my fracture, I had some damage to the sacral nerves in my right leg, so it became weak and I lost some feeling. By now, that has gone away, so I am going to ditch the single leg squats and leg-pulls and start doing regular squats.

I will keep working on the deadlifts and pull-ups. My goal is to hit a least 100 on deads by the end of the year and do a regular, unassisted pull-up by this time next year.

Christopheel, I’m sure my diet could always use some work. Right now, I’m getting 1.5g of protein per pound of body weight; carbs are 80g-100g on cardio days and 1g per pound on weight training days. All of my carbs come from one serving of fruit in the morning, oatmeal peri-workout, legumes early in the day and veggies (broccoli, cabbage, spinach, etc…) the rest of the day. For me, a cheat day consists of having carbs late in the day. On weight training days, I usually eat an extra 300-400 calories. Everyday, I take three servings of fish oil, one at each of my last three meals.

Boss, after my injury, I increased my cal/mag supplements and I began taking Bromelain which has helped quite a bit. Where can I get this joint formula? It looks like it is only available in the UK?

Sorry for the long post. I really appreciate everyone’s advice. All of you have been very patient and helpful. I am most grateful!

[DianaB]

Katie, the last thing you need to worry about when training OL is your numbers. They don't translate into that sort of lifting. With OL, you build your technique first, the heavy weight comes later, but even when working with a very light bar and 5 lbs bumper plates, you build muscle. And the explosive actions of the lifts are going to help you repair some of that bone damage.

Everyone starts somewhere, and if this interests you, then run to a local gym that offers coaching and start. Tell your coach everything about your background, so they can devise a beginners program that suits your needs and has less risk for injury.

I can tell you it is the most empowering lifting you will ever do, feeling strong is the best thing ever!

[Boss Man]

CNP are a transatlantic company, as you will notice by the USA and Britain Flags around Dorian Yates's head, if my memories correct.

It should be able to be bought in North America. You could try e-mailing them, they should have an address, and seeing what they say.

My old gym used ot sock a bit o ftheir stuff for a brief while, and they do do brochures, which i swhere I first noticed this stuff, scanning one of ther brochures. So tehy may be able to send you some kind of Brochure as well, or a PDF version, if they do that now.

Also try going on to a site called Algaecal. You will find a little tool which you can also download, that allows you to click certain foods in your daily diet, and change the portion sizes like 1/2, 1, 2 etc etc, and it calculates your Calcium, Magensium, Vit D and K from those selected foods, against that RDA's, to see how you measure up.

[swanso5]

- well progress will always be harder to come by the further along you get
- i would rather have you get strong at simpler compound fiorst before o lifting, ecpsecially if there is no one to actually shiow you how to do them (deads, front squats, chin ups etc)
- i would keep some single leg stuff in like i did in the program design example
- you could get a pull up in 12 weeks from now if you wanted to..start with chin ups, they use more muscles so you'll progress quicker
- more carbs i'd say...at least 2g/pd/bew on training days and probably more for one trying to increase muscle/strength
- up the fish oil supp, at least 6/day...i have 9g/day...this is about the only thing where the mote the better without wasteing them...i've seen recommendations of up to 40g/day for fat loss
- you can post for as long as you want

[katiesuarez]

I added lunges to my workout yesterday in place of leg-pulls, and dumbbell squats in place of single leg squats. My butt is really sore today. I went up another 10lb on deads, so now those are at 41lb. I am going to add another 10lb every week. I am much more comfortable with those and I think I could easily hit 100lb within two months.

My fish oil is already at 6g per day, plus I eat a serving of ground flaxseed every morning so I know I am getting plenty of EFAs. I can increase to 8g if you think that will help. I will also increase carbs on weight days.

Diana, I actually spoke with some people at two local gyms in my area. Neither of them has anyone who will train in O lifts. I can check two other places today. If they cannot do it, then I guess I’m just SOL.

Do you think if I started a journal, you could pick it apart for me and help me make changes along the way? I would really appreciate it.