Hello all,
I'm new around here, having just discovered this forum. Please forgive me if anything here violates any rules or etiquette, if so, I'll do best to correct it in the future. And also please pardon me if what I'm asking is actually a very common question, but I haven't noticed any threads thus far that have asked precisely what I intend to ask. It might be a rather unusual question.
But first, I'll start with a quick introduction: I'm a 26 year old man from the U.S. During most of childhood and adolescence I was extremely thin ( lunches were always minuscule during school years, usually limited to a tiny salad every day). During early university years, due to stress, hectic schedules, and the related poor eating habits, I put on weight. Though arms and legs are still quite thin, over the years I've developed a big and some neck fat. I never had the motivation to get rid of either, but now I find myself in a relationship with a wonderful woman. Recently, though, we discovered a bit of a problem as our physical intimacy has progressed. Her one issue with me, in regards to physical intimacy, is weight. Besides not being a particularly attractive feature for her, she worries about the health risks associated with big bellies ( family is genetically predisposed to them) and generally poor eating habits in general as well. So I agreed to try and lose the weight as long as she would support me and help me research things to do it in a healthy way. She agreed to do this and also work on getting better shape herself so I wouldn't be totally alone in the attempt.
She did a lot of research into weight loss for men, knowing that men's bodies handle these types of changes differently than women's bodies. Both of us working together found some good information, but one thing we've seen a lot of could be a little troublesome for our purposes. While this aspect of it doesn't affect the health benefits, it does potentially cause a problem for helping her to find me more attractive.
A good deal of weight loss advice for men is focused on both losing weight AND building muscle. In fact, a lot of it seems to imply that some muscle growth is more or less necessary for weight loss in men. (Some sources of information on these issues have been contradictory, however.) partner, though, is specifically attracted to thinness, not bulk, whether the bulk is fat or muscle. The one exception is toned/lean muscle. While we've found many articles for women that focus on losing weight without building muscle, we've found no articles on this subject for men. Nearly all the articles out there assume that all men want to bulk up.
So question is: what are the best methods for men to lose weight without putting on more than a minimum of muscle?
Because I have fairly thin arms and etc. I assume that it might not even be an issue for me. But still, I want to make sure I'm sticking to the practices that will lead to the results we're looking for.
I've already done fairly well with weight loss. Up until earlier this year, weight for years has hovered around 178 or 179 lbs. ( height is 5'7, so it was quite overweight for height). During the late summer a change in living situation for a month caused eating habits to change, and just due to that I went down to about 164 lbs. Once I decided to intentionally lose weight in late September, I began cutting down portions of food by about half (over-eating is one of worst temptations) and doing 2-miles-per-day walks during warmer weather. As of the past week, I've been down to about 156 lbs. Old t-shirts I haven't worn in years have begun to fit me again. So there has been progress already. I just want to make sure that as I move forward I do only the things that will encourage weight loss without much muscle building, and stay on the right track. I got a gym membership last week, due to the cold weather preventing me from walking, and I plan to start a regular practice of visiting there starting next week.
Thanks in advance for your responses and for taking the time to read post!
All the best,
Hyde
Weight Loss Without Muscle Gain for Men
Moderators: cassiegose, Boss Man
Re: Weight Loss Without Muscle Gain for Men
Hi Mr Hyde, good to speak to you.
You are correct that building muscle can positively affect weight loss as an extra 1lb of muscle burns around an extra 45-50 calories a day.
The processes involved in building muscle can also help to strengthen bone density and connective muscle tissue and this is also the case for females, so neither of you should rule it out, however building massive amounts is not necessary, but if you just did loads of cardio that wouldn't work too well, as you might burn muscle and also if you did crappy 1 set of 20 reps style stuff on machines, with measly amounts of weight, that is a waste of time for both males and females.
So actually building some muscle should still be the way to go, but it could be combined with a moderate amount of cardio.
In terms of the diet, which I think I will address first, what times do you eat at and what foods do you eat at those times?
You are correct that building muscle can positively affect weight loss as an extra 1lb of muscle burns around an extra 45-50 calories a day.
The processes involved in building muscle can also help to strengthen bone density and connective muscle tissue and this is also the case for females, so neither of you should rule it out, however building massive amounts is not necessary, but if you just did loads of cardio that wouldn't work too well, as you might burn muscle and also if you did crappy 1 set of 20 reps style stuff on machines, with measly amounts of weight, that is a waste of time for both males and females.
So actually building some muscle should still be the way to go, but it could be combined with a moderate amount of cardio.
In terms of the diet, which I think I will address first, what times do you eat at and what foods do you eat at those times?
Re: Weight Loss Without Muscle Gain for Men
Hi there Boss Man, it's great to hear from you as well. apologies for the late reply, I've been having some computer trouble lately.
You mentioned the positive benefits of muscle building being the same for males and females. I should clarify one thing that I was a bit vague about in original post: girlfriend's goal actually is to put on muscle, while goal is simply to lose weight without adding much muscle at all, at least no more than is absolutely necessary for weight loss. So in her case, far from rule it out, I'm sure she would be happy to find methods that add muscle. I suppose our goals are rather the opposite of what is common for our respective genders, haha. In case, because goal is to be more physically attractive for her, putting on too much muscle could essentially lead to the same problem I already have with fat. She finds bulk of any kind, even the kind traditionally viewed as attractive for men to have, as unattractive. She's only attracted to thinness. It's a rather unusual situation, and hence difficult in finding information on how to lose weight while actively avoiding adding visible muscle bulk.
Now, to answer your questions:
diet before intentional weight loss was certainly unhealthy; lots of fast food, hamburgers, sugar, etc.
current diet limits red meat considerably, so most of meals that contain meat are either based on fish or chicken. I also limit carbs and sugar. Because I lack a lot of time and skill for cooking, I tend to eat a lot of frozen foods. Not ideal, but I try to at least focus on things that are at the healthier end of the scale, and better than the fast food I relied on before. I eat a lot of things like spicy chicken, crusted lemon pepper fish, mango chicken with kale, salmon fillets, salads, oatmeal. For snacks, I eat either almonds, peaches, blackberries, or similar healthy options. indulgences are occasional Starbucks coffees and one chocolate dessert every Friday night. I try to make a habit of not eating the same type of food twice in one day to keep up variety, and to eat at least half the portion sizes I used to eat. And though I limit red meat, I do still have the occasional hamburger or, more frequently, a burrito from a local restaurant.
Now, as for the question of when I eat, that's a bit more difficult to answer. For most of life I've had issues with insomnia and thus the times I sleep (and eat) are frequently changing. I've never been able to do much about this, and at this point I more or less accept it after trying for years to regulate sleep patterns. I'm only grateful that as far as work is concerned, I make own hours (I work online in freelance writing jobs). During university years I would frequently go without much sleep for days at a time as a result of schedule combining with inability to sleep at consistent times.
Though the exact times themselves shift fairly frequently (they seem to shift with the seasons, oddly), I do generally sleep a consistent number of hours most of the time. Usually I sleep about 8 or 9 hours. I generally eat only twice a day (I know that breakfast is "the most important meal of the day" but ever since early childhood, waking up early and eating makes me very nauseous, so I've never been able to stick to the habit). I tend to eat about an hour after waking up, then again four to five hours after that, with maybe a small snack of almonds or fruit in between, and perhaps later in the evening.
This morning, I didn't fall asleep until about 8 AM or 8:30, and then woke (to surprise) at 5:30 PM. That's nearly a record for me as I usually sleep until the early afternoon (once again, thank goodness for being able to make own hours). most common sleep cycle is to fall asleep about 3 or 4 AM and wake about 1 PM. I seem to sleep more during the day in the fall, switch back to sleeping at night during early winter, switch again to day-time sleep after New Year's, then go back to night-time sleep in early spring. It's very strange, but I've been this way most of life. In early December or early spring, I might easily go to bed about 10 or 11 PM and wake up early at 7 or 8 AM.
You mentioned the positive benefits of muscle building being the same for males and females. I should clarify one thing that I was a bit vague about in original post: girlfriend's goal actually is to put on muscle, while goal is simply to lose weight without adding much muscle at all, at least no more than is absolutely necessary for weight loss. So in her case, far from rule it out, I'm sure she would be happy to find methods that add muscle. I suppose our goals are rather the opposite of what is common for our respective genders, haha. In case, because goal is to be more physically attractive for her, putting on too much muscle could essentially lead to the same problem I already have with fat. She finds bulk of any kind, even the kind traditionally viewed as attractive for men to have, as unattractive. She's only attracted to thinness. It's a rather unusual situation, and hence difficult in finding information on how to lose weight while actively avoiding adding visible muscle bulk.
Now, to answer your questions:
diet before intentional weight loss was certainly unhealthy; lots of fast food, hamburgers, sugar, etc.
current diet limits red meat considerably, so most of meals that contain meat are either based on fish or chicken. I also limit carbs and sugar. Because I lack a lot of time and skill for cooking, I tend to eat a lot of frozen foods. Not ideal, but I try to at least focus on things that are at the healthier end of the scale, and better than the fast food I relied on before. I eat a lot of things like spicy chicken, crusted lemon pepper fish, mango chicken with kale, salmon fillets, salads, oatmeal. For snacks, I eat either almonds, peaches, blackberries, or similar healthy options. indulgences are occasional Starbucks coffees and one chocolate dessert every Friday night. I try to make a habit of not eating the same type of food twice in one day to keep up variety, and to eat at least half the portion sizes I used to eat. And though I limit red meat, I do still have the occasional hamburger or, more frequently, a burrito from a local restaurant.
Now, as for the question of when I eat, that's a bit more difficult to answer. For most of life I've had issues with insomnia and thus the times I sleep (and eat) are frequently changing. I've never been able to do much about this, and at this point I more or less accept it after trying for years to regulate sleep patterns. I'm only grateful that as far as work is concerned, I make own hours (I work online in freelance writing jobs). During university years I would frequently go without much sleep for days at a time as a result of schedule combining with inability to sleep at consistent times.
Though the exact times themselves shift fairly frequently (they seem to shift with the seasons, oddly), I do generally sleep a consistent number of hours most of the time. Usually I sleep about 8 or 9 hours. I generally eat only twice a day (I know that breakfast is "the most important meal of the day" but ever since early childhood, waking up early and eating makes me very nauseous, so I've never been able to stick to the habit). I tend to eat about an hour after waking up, then again four to five hours after that, with maybe a small snack of almonds or fruit in between, and perhaps later in the evening.
This morning, I didn't fall asleep until about 8 AM or 8:30, and then woke (to surprise) at 5:30 PM. That's nearly a record for me as I usually sleep until the early afternoon (once again, thank goodness for being able to make own hours). most common sleep cycle is to fall asleep about 3 or 4 AM and wake about 1 PM. I seem to sleep more during the day in the fall, switch back to sleeping at night during early winter, switch again to day-time sleep after New Year's, then go back to night-time sleep in early spring. It's very strange, but I've been this way most of life. In early December or early spring, I might easily go to bed about 10 or 11 PM and wake up early at 7 or 8 AM.
Re: Weight Loss Without Muscle Gain for Men
No need to apologise, it's completely understandable.
This is the sort of thing I post for people sometimes and you might find it useful.
Breakfast
Option 1.
Bowl of Whole-grain Cereal and 1 rasher of Bacon, fat trimmed off and scrambled Eggs, (2 Egg Whites + Yolk)
Option 2.
Protein shake, small portion of Nuts, (excluding higher carb ones like Cashews, Chestnuts and Grapenuts), + Apple. Give the Apple 10-15 minutes to digest to improve digestion.
Snack
Option 1.
Portion of Turkey + Orange
Option 2.
Small Portion of Peanuts, some Chicken + Raw Carrott.
Lunch
Option 1.
Large Beef Sandwich with trimmings, I.E. Tomato, Lettuce, Cucumber etc.
Option 2.
Bowl of Chicken Soup, + Pot of yoghurt.
Snack
Option 1.
Turkey + Cashews
Option 2.
Ham + 2 large Tomatos
Dinner
Option 1.
Pork with mashed Potato.
Option 2.
Chicken and Rice
Option 3.
100g Halibut + Broccoli
Snack
Option 1.
Beans on Toast
Option 2.
Ham Sandwich, no trimmings.
Easy on the bread with both options.
You could add a few things to certain meals, like Sea Salt, Cracked Black Pepper, Parsley, Mustard, Herbs, Garlic.
You could alter one or two of thses to suit current food choices, as this is not a definitive thing by any means.
As for meal times I'd try to eat around 2.5-3 hours after the previous meal.
Hopefully this looks workable
.
This is the sort of thing I post for people sometimes and you might find it useful.
Breakfast
Option 1.
Bowl of Whole-grain Cereal and 1 rasher of Bacon, fat trimmed off and scrambled Eggs, (2 Egg Whites + Yolk)
Option 2.
Protein shake, small portion of Nuts, (excluding higher carb ones like Cashews, Chestnuts and Grapenuts), + Apple. Give the Apple 10-15 minutes to digest to improve digestion.
Snack
Option 1.
Portion of Turkey + Orange
Option 2.
Small Portion of Peanuts, some Chicken + Raw Carrott.
Lunch
Option 1.
Large Beef Sandwich with trimmings, I.E. Tomato, Lettuce, Cucumber etc.
Option 2.
Bowl of Chicken Soup, + Pot of yoghurt.
Snack
Option 1.
Turkey + Cashews
Option 2.
Ham + 2 large Tomatos
Dinner
Option 1.
Pork with mashed Potato.
Option 2.
Chicken and Rice
Option 3.
100g Halibut + Broccoli
Snack
Option 1.
Beans on Toast
Option 2.
Ham Sandwich, no trimmings.
Easy on the bread with both options.
You could add a few things to certain meals, like Sea Salt, Cracked Black Pepper, Parsley, Mustard, Herbs, Garlic.
You could alter one or two of thses to suit current food choices, as this is not a definitive thing by any means.
As for meal times I'd try to eat around 2.5-3 hours after the previous meal.
Hopefully this looks workable
.Re: Weight Loss Without Muscle Gain for Men
Sorry once again for the delay in replies, I've still been struggling with PC lately.
First of all, thank you for this meal plan! I'll definitely keep this in mind and see how I can best implement it. Of course, as you said, some things would be changed for food preferences, availability, etc., but it's a great template!
As a follow up, what exercises do you recommend? During warmer months (and on the odd warm day in the colder seasons, like today in fact) I simply make a habit of doing a two mile walk. I recently joined a local gym and plan on visiting there daily during week days. So far I've only been there once, and I focused on the stationary bike (15 minutes, for about 2.3 miles) and the treadmill (25 or 30 minutes, for about 2.5 or 3 miles, I believe) at a steady pace, with occasional bursts of a brisker pace. The gym has a lot of weight training options but I'm wary of trying these, as primary goal is to become thinner, not bulkier, even though, as you've confirmed before, some muscle gain is good for weight loss. I'm still concerned that even that 1 lb. of muscle, while helping the overall weight loss, might effectively keep me from the actual goal I'm seeking (trading fat for muscle will, with respect to the situation with relationship, leave me with the same sort of problem I've started with, albeit I would be physically healthier, relationship situation would be no better). I'm really concerned with what exercises will help burn fat while keeping off more than an absolute minimum of muscle at the same time. Some articles I've read have said that things like yoga and Pilates can be good for weight loss without muscle gain, but these articles seemed to be written for women, not men, and I'm not sure if the same advice applies.
If you have any further thoughts, please let me know, and thank you again for your help!
First of all, thank you for this meal plan! I'll definitely keep this in mind and see how I can best implement it. Of course, as you said, some things would be changed for food preferences, availability, etc., but it's a great template!
As a follow up, what exercises do you recommend? During warmer months (and on the odd warm day in the colder seasons, like today in fact) I simply make a habit of doing a two mile walk. I recently joined a local gym and plan on visiting there daily during week days. So far I've only been there once, and I focused on the stationary bike (15 minutes, for about 2.3 miles) and the treadmill (25 or 30 minutes, for about 2.5 or 3 miles, I believe) at a steady pace, with occasional bursts of a brisker pace. The gym has a lot of weight training options but I'm wary of trying these, as primary goal is to become thinner, not bulkier, even though, as you've confirmed before, some muscle gain is good for weight loss. I'm still concerned that even that 1 lb. of muscle, while helping the overall weight loss, might effectively keep me from the actual goal I'm seeking (trading fat for muscle will, with respect to the situation with relationship, leave me with the same sort of problem I've started with, albeit I would be physically healthier, relationship situation would be no better). I'm really concerned with what exercises will help burn fat while keeping off more than an absolute minimum of muscle at the same time. Some articles I've read have said that things like yoga and Pilates can be good for weight loss without muscle gain, but these articles seemed to be written for women, not men, and I'm not sure if the same advice applies.
If you have any further thoughts, please let me know, and thank you again for your help!
Re: Weight Loss Without Muscle Gain for Men
This is something that might work for you, as I have posted it before
Squats, 2 sets, 10 reps
Lunges, 2 sets, 10 reps
Deadlifts, 2 sets, 10 reps
Bent over Rows, 2 sets, 10 reps
Bench press, 2 sets, 10 reps
Shrugs, 2 sets, 10 reps
Planks 30 seconds.
In relation to the training ideas I gave you above, your workouts and cardio schedule could look something like this.
Day 1. Weights
Day 2. Cardio
Day 3. Weights
Day 4. Day off
Day 5. Cardio
Day 6. Weights
Day 7. Day off.
This prevents you doing 5 days straight and 2 days of nothing, as I think that's allowing too much consecutive taxation and 2 days of your body doing nothing, slowly starting to adjust to it, before 5 days of grind again, which might take the edge off progress potential, so the 5 split days should be better for you.
The cardio could be anything you want.
After around 4-6 weeks, you should be ready to hit the weights harder and push your body a bit more in a progressive way
Squats, 2 sets, 10 reps
Lunges, 2 sets, 10 reps
Deadlifts, 2 sets, 10 reps
Bent over Rows, 2 sets, 10 reps
Bench press, 2 sets, 10 reps
Shrugs, 2 sets, 10 reps
Planks 30 seconds.
In relation to the training ideas I gave you above, your workouts and cardio schedule could look something like this.
Day 1. Weights
Day 2. Cardio
Day 3. Weights
Day 4. Day off
Day 5. Cardio
Day 6. Weights
Day 7. Day off.
This prevents you doing 5 days straight and 2 days of nothing, as I think that's allowing too much consecutive taxation and 2 days of your body doing nothing, slowly starting to adjust to it, before 5 days of grind again, which might take the edge off progress potential, so the 5 split days should be better for you.
The cardio could be anything you want.
After around 4-6 weeks, you should be ready to hit the weights harder and push your body a bit more in a progressive way
Re: Weight Loss Without Muscle Gain for Men
I just wanted to stop in and say hello! Good luck with your goals!
Re: Weight Loss Without Muscle Gain for Men
Apologies once again for the very slow reply on part; I ended up having a minor medical procedure done recently, followed by an illness, and I haven't been online as much. I'm clear to begin exercise again in the middle of this coming week, however, and I hope to put the advice I've found here to good use.
First of all, Boss Man, thanks very much once again for your advice! This sounds like an excellent exercise plan. It definitely sounds like a nice and do-able schedule for someone at early level. I really appreciate you sharing it, and the food plan, with me.
And also, to Alinshop, hello to you too, and thank you as well for the kind words! Upon a recent weight in I discovered that from late September to early November I've lost over 12 lbs., so I feel I'm off to a good start at the very least. According to most recent doctor visit, BMI has already hit the healthy range. I still plan to push forward though, I haven't reached personal goal yet. I'll take all the luck I can get in continuing! Thanks once again to you both!
First of all, Boss Man, thanks very much once again for your advice! This sounds like an excellent exercise plan. It definitely sounds like a nice and do-able schedule for someone at early level. I really appreciate you sharing it, and the food plan, with me.
And also, to Alinshop, hello to you too, and thank you as well for the kind words! Upon a recent weight in I discovered that from late September to early November I've lost over 12 lbs., so I feel I'm off to a good start at the very least. According to most recent doctor visit, BMI has already hit the healthy range. I still plan to push forward though, I haven't reached personal goal yet. I'll take all the luck I can get in continuing! Thanks once again to you both!
Re: Weight Loss Without Muscle Gain for Men
No need to apologise man, stuff happens sometimes and clearly not always for the best, but you're over your issues now it seems, so just keep believing and GOOD LUCK .
.Re: Weight Loss Without Muscle Gain for Men
Wow...you lost weight w/out even really knowing it! Congrats to you! 
Re: Weight Loss Without Muscle Gain for Men
Personally, I'd say don't be afraid of muscle. Muscle can come in a lot of different forms. Bodybuilders want to pump up the muscle to make it look big, while a strength trainer just cares about how strong the muscle is, while someone like a swimmer wants the muscle to be lean. They're all building muscle - just different types of muscle. Given your goals I can totally see you going for something like a swimmers body - lean, but muscular.
Put extra effort into the muscle groups that will make you look thinner. So lots of work on your abs and obliques. Broad shoulders will make your waist look thinner, so work on your delts a lot as well. For health reasons if you're prone to a big you should work on building a bigger to reduce your waist to hip ratio (which is tied to all sorts of cardiovascular problems if too high). So focus on your glutes as well. A tight, muscular won't make you look bulky - but it's one of the biggest muscles in the body - you can pack on a lot of muscle in that location.
In general try to build lean, compact muscle, not big bulky muscle. I've always heard doing high reps with lower weight builds lean muscle, though lately I saw a YouTube video that said just the opposite (though I suspect the experience of guys who do steroids isn't really relevant in your case).
Anyway, don't be afraid of muscle. Just be strategic in how you build it - build it in a way that makes you look thinner.
Put extra effort into the muscle groups that will make you look thinner. So lots of work on your abs and obliques. Broad shoulders will make your waist look thinner, so work on your delts a lot as well. For health reasons if you're prone to a big you should work on building a bigger to reduce your waist to hip ratio (which is tied to all sorts of cardiovascular problems if too high). So focus on your glutes as well. A tight, muscular won't make you look bulky - but it's one of the biggest muscles in the body - you can pack on a lot of muscle in that location.
In general try to build lean, compact muscle, not big bulky muscle. I've always heard doing high reps with lower weight builds lean muscle, though lately I saw a YouTube video that said just the opposite (though I suspect the experience of guys who do steroids isn't really relevant in your case).
Anyway, don't be afraid of muscle. Just be strategic in how you build it - build it in a way that makes you look thinner.
Re: Weight Loss Without Muscle Gain for Men
Hi rep low weight is dog turd in opinion. You get little stimulus of muscle and potentially just a pump and some lactic acid, but for building muscle it is a poor methodology that will yield ineffective long-term results.
Failure training is unnecessary, but at least high reps for 90%-95% max lift for reps could be aimed for, but more effectively, keep the 90%-95% max lifts mentality and cut the reps to between 6-10.
Failure training is unnecessary, but at least high reps for 90%-95% max lift for reps could be aimed for, but more effectively, keep the 90%-95% max lifts mentality and cut the reps to between 6-10.
Re: Weight Loss Without Muscle Gain for Men
Boss Man wrote:Hi rep low weight is dog turd in opinion. You get little stimulus of muscle and potentially just a pump and some lactic acid, but for building muscle it is a poor methodology that will yield ineffective long-term results.
Failure training is unnecessary, but at least high reps for 90%-95% max lift for reps could be aimed for, but more effectively, keep the 90%-95% max lifts mentality and cut the reps to between 6-10.
Have you ever utilized this method?
Re: Weight Loss Without Muscle Gain for Men
Which one of those methods are you referring to?
High rep low weight
High rep high weight
Low rep high weight
Failure training.
As I mentioned them all in one sense or another.
Oh and are you asking in order to disagree, or to understand any personal experience I may have? I don't mind if you disagree with viewpoint on something, if that is indeed why you ask, as that's all part of discussion
High rep low weight
High rep high weight
Low rep high weight
Failure training.
As I mentioned them all in one sense or another.
Oh and are you asking in order to disagree, or to understand any personal experience I may have? I don't mind if you disagree with viewpoint on something, if that is indeed why you ask, as that's all part of discussion
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Sheppardmethod
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Re: Weight Loss Without Muscle Gain for Men
Hey have you tried Pilates? It's a workout that's based on using your own body's weight as resistance, so I think that if you are trying to build minimal muscle, this would be a good option for you. It also helps you to gain more flexibility, as well as more control over your muscles and more endurance.