Where are my chest muscles?

[krozflash]

I am 16 years old and i'm trying to grow some muscles on my chest. I have a FLAT chest and i am trying to get some mass on it. Can any one help with some tip or execises?

[swanso5]

you're not really doing a machine preacher curl which has soft padding onthe handles with gloves on are you?

maybe you should tell us what you do for your chest?

[krozflash]

No, i usually do machine chest presses with some some pull ups and push ups to follow.

[vamp]

Bench press -- use free weights! Oh and if you can't do 3 sets of 20 PROPER push-ups(watch a video on you-tube), work on that first before using the weights. Body weight excercise is good excercise!

cheers

[Smerdons]

Oh and if you can't do 3 sets of 20 PROPER push-ups(watch a video on you-tube), work on that first before using the weights.

I have a small gripe about this advice. I've seen similar advice here, before and it bugs me a bit. People who say that someone has no business doing bench press if they can't do a push-up. The thing is, you can't really change the amount of weight that you have to move when you do a push-up; you're stuck doing a 'regular' push-up, or doing one from the knees. I seem to recall that a regular push-up is about the same as doing a bench press of 70% of your body weight (I'm not sure what % it would be from the knees).

For someone who is really out of shape, or really overweight, the lack of flexibility in this body weight workout can be an issue. Wouldn't it be better, in that case, for the individual to do a bench press instead, since they could lower the weight to an amount that they could handle, allowing them to work the muscles?

When I started working out recently, I was both out-of-shape and overweight. I could *maybe* do 5 push-ups (and that's a big maybe). Trying to do those for a chest workout did not seem very productive to me. What I could do, though, was put some weights on the bar and get through 3 sets of bench presses. I could increase the weight little-by-little, and easily see the results of doing that workout. Now, I am able to do lots of push-ups. I'm not sure if I would've have gotten to this point so quickly if I had followed the advice of some individuals (even though their intentions were good).

It is frustrating to not get through a set of push-ups. Putting a reasonable load on a bar and doing a bench press seems like a good way to condition the body if a person is unable to do a push-up in the first place.

[vamp]

From my point of view, doing body weight before weights helps the body climatize to strength training, increases flexibility, and is less likely to overtax the joints. Instead of developing a "weight" mentality one first develops and focuses on their own body's abilities and limits. Instead of focusing on a bar or dumbbell one is focusing on their body and thus how the excercise feels and how it affects them. This is important to all physical training. Ultimately, talking to your doctor and finding the right route for oneself is the best approach.

cheers

PS... lesplease I believe you are correct, swanso I think quoted those numbers in a post a couple of months ago if I'm not mistaken.

[swanso5]

When I started working out recently, I was both out-of-shape and overweight. I could *maybe* do 5 push-ups (and that's a big maybe). Trying to do those for a chest workout did not seem very productive to me. What I could do, though, was put some weights on the bar and get through 3 sets of bench presses. I could increase the weight little-by-little, and easily see the results of doing that workout. Now, I am able to do lots of push-ups. I'm not sure if I would've have gotten to this point so quickly if I had followed the advice of some individuals (even though their intentions were good).

well if you did 3 sets for bench presses where tyou used less muscles thus burning less calories and/or building less muscle overall, and i can only assume you did 10 reps per set for 30 total reps then why not simply do 6 sets of 5 reps of pusdh ups for the same volume? what's the difference?

you can always use a smith machine or squat rack and set the bar at a ht that you can do "x" amount of reps from

60 - 70% of bw per push up from feet, wouldnl;t have a clue from the knees really but they're not really wrth it anyway, limited core involvement ewhich is most people's weak link in the poush upo so you'll never priogress to them...that's why doing them elevated is better as the core is still required to keep you strtaight

www.uponlinetraining.com

[vamp]

limited core involvement ewhich is most people's weak link in the poush upo so you'll never priogress to them...that's why doing them elevated is better as the core is still required to keep you strtaight

http://www.uponlinetraining.com

Forgot that point, thanks swanso

cheers

[Smerdons]

well if you did 3 sets for bench presses where tyou used less muscles thus burning less calories and/or building less muscle overall, and i can only assume you did 10 reps per set for 30 total reps then why not simply do 6 sets of 5 reps of pusdh ups for the same volume? what's the difference?

The difference is simply personal satisfaction. It felt better to bet through 3x10 bench presses, being able to add 5 or 10 pounds per week than it does to be able to do 1 extra push-up. It is easier for me to measure progress one plate at a time (well, technically 2, but I think you get the point). I'd be willing to bet that others who are in a similar situation would feel the same way (i.e. morbidly obese people who are unable to do a single push-up).

[swanso5]

well if i was to do the math, you'd have better "actual number results" as in total wt lifted with the push ups each session...if you want faster progress go the push ups, if you don;t do the bench presses

[Smerdons]

But the original point of the post (that I made) still has not been addressed: people who are unable to do a single push-up. Are you advocating that it is better for a 400 pound man who is morbidly obese to do 3 sets of 1/2 of a push-up instead of putting weight on a bar, or hopping on a machine, and doing a press at a significantly lower weight? I've seen 'expert' advice from people saying that 'if you can't do a push-up, you shouldn't be doing a bench press!'. To me, this advice seems flawed.

That advice may not have been flawed in my case because I was actually able to do a push-up or two when I first started working out, but I can think of a lot of people who can't do a single push-up who would not benefit from that advice. Doing the numbers for me at my starting weight, doing 5 sets of 5 push-ups would have definitely resulted in me moving more total weight than doing 3x10 bench presses at a lower weight (than 70% bw). So yeah, better actual number results for me would have been achieved by doing push-ups, even a smaller number of reps per set.

Another factor for me is a goal to spend time with my dad, who cannot do a push-up, and get some good exercise in at the same time. I'm looking to get in better shape, increase my general health. I'm looking to bring my dad along for the ride. It is not fun working out with a partner when you both can't do the same lifts. So, I chose to do bench presses instead of push-ups, for the personal satisfaction that I mentioned earlier and because it is an exercise that my workout partner can do, too.

[swanso5]

a 400pder i wouldn't even have them lift anything really, i'd just have them move...basic walking for 10 - 30mins will do a 400pder in most cases...his biggest problem is what is going into his mouth

and there are always exceptions obviously

[vamp]

I believe smerdons you missed one very important point that swanso pointed out. Pushups use more muscles in the body (even doing 1/2 pushups [negatives]). By using more muscle you will build more muscle and also burn more fat then and in the future from the muscle you have gained.

Also, by utilizing the core muscles with a pushup that are not used pretty much not at all with a bench press, you are strengthening the muscles that will help with posture and help prevent injury in the long term. Remember, overall body conditioning is far more important healthwise than how much one can lift or how many pushups, setting goals to achieve by these standards help track progress and motivate us to each new level of fitness.

As far as a 400 lb morbidly obese individual, I would first have a doctor check him, then help with diet and basic walking excercises. Much more would probably increase the morbid part.

I hope this helped.

cheers

PS. Now that you've been working with the bench press and increasing there, you really should try pushups again for the core aspect of the excercise. See how many reps you can do for 3 sets. You probably will find your shoulders, abs and lower back will give out long before your pectorials.

[Boss Man]

400 pounders would be advised in my way of thinking, to change diet and do some mild Cardio, about 5 times a week, splitting the off days, 3 on 1 off, 2 on, 1 off, increasing a little in intensity each week.

I wouldn't suggest anyone like that be given weights initially, incase their dietary problems had affected stuff like Bone density, so no resistance work at all initially, push-ups or Bench Pressing included, because bearing weight on any small joints with a Push-up, even things like a Knuckle, might be an issue if the Bones have a poor density.

Dietary changes and monitored Cardio would permit some weight loss, and allow for better promotion of things like Bone health, then when the individual had lost maybe 80-100lbs, then scored higher than -1 on a T or Z score, then go for weights, with a TBT adaption system for 4-6 weeks, followed by more intense TBT or a basic 4 or 5 day split.

[Smerdons]

Thanks for all the feedback, guys! I think I'm finally starting to understand that advice. It just needs to be expanded a little bit to include 'if you are in any condition to be lifting weights...'